[wiki-standards] Hello - request comments on Creole

[Martin Junghans]

Hi Mike,

these extensions are not Creole! Treat it as a placeholder or macro
among Creole markup, that allows you to embed some external content, for
instant. As you won't need it to start, please use the versions without
extension.

We also faced problems with the incompleteness of Creole's prose
specification. The Creole guys didn't take the benefits of a grammar (or
at least more formal and sound) specification into account, since
they primarily aim simplicity for users. We derived our interpretation
of Creole from the wikicreole.org forum and their Sandbox (as a
reference implementation).

Good luck!
Martin



On Mon, 2008-06-02 at 12:26 +0100, Mike Haseler wrote:
> Dirk,
> 
> Thanks for that. The first human response I've had!!
> 
> One glance at your grammar and I can say it isn't how I interpreted the 
> specification (perhaps all I need to turn the page upside down joke!). 
> But then again I was beginning to wonder whether it was possible to 
> produce a grammar for the specification of the markup as I understand it.
> 
> what is extension.g ? There seems to be no obvious text to say what is 
> "with and without extension.g".
> 
> Based on the apparent goal of creole to be as uncontroversial as 
> possible and do nothing that would change anything I was thinking of 
> calling my alternative "Kirk" as in:-
> 
> '''To **boldly** go where __no man__ has gone before ,,^,, ~^^^~^^^ |Kirk'''
> 
> thanks again,
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> Dirk Riehle wrote:
> > Hi, Mike,
> > 
> > Thanks for the note. We developed a precise grammar to cope exactly
> > with these issues. We even developed two versions, one following the
> > official spec, one taking astricter view. (I.e. require closing tags
> > at paragraph end.
> > 
> > You can find things on riehle.org incl tools to get you implemented
> > quickly. Follow the wiki tag.
> > 
> >>>From the traffic and requests I get through this I can reassure it is
> > anything but dead ;-) At this stage all people want is just one
> > solution, no hassles.
> > 
> > (And sorry, I'm not monitoring the Creole wiki.)
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Dirk
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On 6/2/08, Mike Haseler <mike at lenzie.org.uk> wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> I've spent the last few weeks trying to come to grips with what is
> >> optimistically called the creole "specification".
> >>
> >> I say "optimistically", because because even the very simplest things
> >> like whether there can be a space between bold and the text isn't
> >> defined. (ie **bold** vs. ** bold ** )
> >>
> >> I believe the problem stems from a total opposition of goals between the
> >> project and my own requirements.
> >>
> >> Creole seems to be a "nice-to-have" list of "similarities" which you
> >> "might like to implement" if you feel like it.
> >>
> >> In contrast, I just want a defined markup specification so that I can be
> >> sure I am compatible without all the hassle of trying to work out what
> >> this or that should do.
> >>
> >> I've reached the stage, where I'm basically dumping the creole idea as a
> >> waste of time because I keep posting comments on the wiki and get no reply.
> >>
> >> ======
> >> Aim,
> >>
> >> my aim is to create a basic form of format that can be used across a
> >> wide range of applications from wikis, to blogs, to message boards, to
> >> private messages, to adverts for houses, to address lists for scouts.
> >>
> >> The applications have two things in commons:
> >>
> >> 1. They share the same username/password/authentication system
> >> 2. They share the same text interface.
> >>
> >> I'm not in principle against wizi-wig textual interfaces, except that I
> >> regularly post on bulletin boards with such wizi-wig interfaces, and I
> >> never use them, so they are a toupee to markup not hair transplant.
> >>
> >> =====
> >> Reason for writing,
> >>
> >> I reached that stage in the pistophonous curve where I wished I'd never
> >> started this project because I can't write one bit of code without
> >> finding that I've got a bug in another bit, and to be honest the creole
> >> spec is light relief compared to debugging some of the stuff I've written.
> >>
> >> And, I'm now so deep in the shit, and have so much newly written code
> >> that I realise it's going to take months and months to test this blasted
> >> thing .... and I may as well get into practice with blogging because
> >> with no one else involved in the project, I'm going to be talking to
> >> myself for months if not years at the current rate of progress.
> >>
> >> Mike
> >>
> >> PS. 14,000 characters on my test case, and I'm still regularly finding
> >> new problems and adding them to my test cases. (can a table have a
> >> numbered list, why doesn't Firefox implement &shy;)
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> > 
> 
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